Mac68k Forums

Home


Welcome, Guest
Guest Settings
Help

Mac68k Forums » Development » Software Hacking

Thread: AppleTalk over IP


Reply to this Thread Reply to this Thread Search Forum Search Forum Back to Thread List Back to Thread List

Permlink Replies: 20 - Pages: 2 [ 1 2 | Next ] - Last Post: Apr 13, 2019 11:19 AM Last Post By: bbraun Threads: [ Previous | Next ]
bbraun


Posts: 493
Registered: 7/25/12
AppleTalk over IP
Posted: Feb 12, 2013 10:19 PM
Click to report abuse...   Click to reply to this thread Reply
My latest project has been to get AppleTalk working over IP. With landonf's help we've setup a server on mac68k.info.
You can use the client software and select it as an AppleTalk device from the AppleTalk or Network control panels. Once connected, you'll essentially be on the same "local" AppleTalk network as everyone else who is connected. You can use the Chooser to find file servers on the network, and in theory, play games or use any other AppleTalk software.

It has been tested with System 7.1 with pre-OT networking, all the way to OS9.

I've made a wiki page with information on how to use it.
landonf


Posts: 86
Registered: 7/23/12
Re: AppleTalk over IP
Posted: Feb 21, 2013 11:39 PM   in response to: bbraun in response to: bbraun
Click to report abuse...   Click to reply to this thread Reply
I've posted a basic Wireshark dissector for the protocol here: https://mac68k.info/wiki/display/mac68k/Wireshark+Dissector

It'll hand off to the appropriate underlying dissector (eg, NBP).
landonf


Posts: 86
Registered: 7/23/12
Re: AppleTalk over IP
Posted: Feb 22, 2013 8:36 AM   in response to: landonf in response to: landonf
Click to report abuse...   Click to reply to this thread Reply
landonf wrote:
I've posted a basic Wireshark dissector for the protocol here: https://mac68k.info/wiki/display/mac68k/Wireshark+Dissector

It'll hand off to the appropriate underlying dissector (eg, NBP).

Just uploaded a second version that should work around bugs in the AppleTalk dissectors triggered by calling into them directly. Instead, we use the LLAP dissector, which in turn calls the short DDP dissector, and so forth.
bbraun


Posts: 493
Registered: 7/25/12
Re: AppleTalk over IP
Posted: Feb 23, 2013 5:45 PM   in response to: bbraun in response to: bbraun
Click to report abuse...   Click to reply to this thread Reply
Thanks to landonf's wireshark dissector and dougg3's help testing, I've got a netatalk server on the AppleTalk VPN. You can log in with the service username/password used for the AVPN login.
Authenticated users get a directory in the "users" folder automatically created for them on first login. You can store whatever you want there, and the contents are viewable to guests and all other authenticated users. Authenticated users can also upload things into the "archive" folder.
Or you can just use guest access for a read-only experience.
bbraun


Posts: 493
Registered: 7/25/12
Re: AppleTalk over IP
Posted: Feb 24, 2013 7:14 PM   in response to: bbraun in response to: bbraun
Click to report abuse...   Click to reply to this thread Reply
I've setup a wiki page about the AFP server here:
https://mac68k.info/wiki/display/mac68k/Mac68k+AppleShare+Server

I've gone through and put some bits of nostalgia on the server, stop by and take a look!
tt


Posts: 144
Registered: 8/25/12
Re: AppleTalk over IP
Posted: Feb 25, 2013 12:18 AM   in response to: bbraun in response to: bbraun
Click to report abuse...   Click to reply to this thread Reply
Very cool... I tried it out earlier, it worked completely once, but I ran into a couple of issues. I am not sure if it is my hardware (SE/30 with 7.5.5), so I will write down the errors I ran into to see what you guys think:

When I first went to the chooser to select the server, after I selected AppleShare I saw some server names come up in the list and then it crashed. Macsbug reported:


User break at 001F0610 ReadCompletion+02F6
Unexpected authentication state
ReadCompletion
+02F6 001F0610 *MOVE.B $0440(A2),D3


Another couple times the machine froze and I hit the debugger:


No procedure name
00173484 *TST.W D1

No procedure name
00202E0E * DBF D0,*+$0000; 00202E0E


And another time it reported a similar error to the first error:

User break at 000E07C0 ReadCompletion+02F6
Unexpected authentication state
ReadCompletion
+02F6 000E07C0 *MOVE.B $0440(A2),D3

bbraun


Posts: 493
Registered: 7/25/12
Re: AppleTalk over IP
Posted: Feb 25, 2013 11:26 AM   in response to: tt in response to: tt
Click to report abuse...   Click to reply to this thread Reply
Thanks for giving it a try tt! I think it's been just landonf, dougg3, and I so far. We hadn't seen that, so it's good you've tried it!
I'm not really sure what's going on, the unexpected authentication state is... unexpected. The only thing I can think of offhand is the authentication procedure is not resilient to packet loss. I've got a slightly modified version of the client that resets the authentication state and will prompt you to try again if it hits that case.
avpn0.4.8.1.cpt.hqx

Can you share a bit more about your setup? Are you using the Asante card in the SE/30 or do you have a SCSI ethernet solution? I'm assuming you're using OT with the 7.5.5 setup. Do you have otherwise good connectivity?
If you happen to have a machine that can see the SE/30's traffic, a packet capture could be helpful too. Using tcpdump it would be something like:
tcpdump -n -i <interface> -s0 -w avpn.pcap port 1029

Thanks for testing it out and reporting back. Let me know if that new version helps at all. I expect it might pop up with a "login failed, retrying" message a couple times, but hopefully that's all, and is better than hitting macsbug.
bbraun


Posts: 493
Registered: 7/25/12
Re: AppleTalk over IP
Posted: Feb 27, 2013 3:03 PM   in response to: bbraun in response to: bbraun
Click to report abuse...   Click to reply to this thread Reply
I've updated the client to avpn0.4.9 and updated the link on the wiki.
The update is also available in my directory on the file server.

Version 0.4.6 used a fixed IP address for contacting the server, 0.4.8 went to DNS resolution.
In the course of adding DNS resolution, pre-OT systems got broken. 0.4.9 should work on both pre-OT and OT systems.
bbraun


Posts: 493
Registered: 7/25/12
Re: AppleTalk over IP
Posted: Mar 1, 2013 12:20 AM   in response to: bbraun in response to: bbraun
Click to report abuse...   Click to reply to this thread Reply
I've put up a web server on the netatalk file server and have it serving content out of public_html directories in user folders on the file server. So feel free to connect to the appletalk vpn and fileserver, create yourself a public_html directory, and upload content.
It can be a convenient way to transfer files off the mac to modern machines.

Information on the wiki: https://mac68k.info/wiki/display/mac68k/Hosted+User+HTTP+Content
bbraun


Posts: 493
Registered: 7/25/12
Re: AppleTalk over IP
Posted: Mar 1, 2013 8:40 PM   in response to: bbraun in response to: bbraun
Click to report abuse...   Click to reply to this thread Reply
Updated to avpn0.4.9.1. The only difference with this version is it increases the number of send buffers. I found in testing some copies of large numbers of files from a slow (IIx) pre-OT avpn client to the afp server that MacTCP couldn't send out the packets as fast as AppleTalk wanted. Upping the number of buffers seemed to resolve the issue and I was able to successfully upload lots of files to the server from a IIx running plain MacTCP.

Wiki page is updated, and it's on the file server in my homedir.
tt


Posts: 144
Registered: 8/25/12
Re: AppleTalk over IP
Posted: Mar 4, 2013 1:32 AM   in response to: bbraun in response to: bbraun
Click to report abuse...   Click to reply to this thread Reply
I tried avpn0.4.9.1 and it seemed to work better. I was able to log in and upload a file, and see other user files. I still am wondering if I am having hardware issues due to aging PSU/analog board. I ended up testing with an Asante MacCon IIsi/SE-30 and a '030 50MHz Daystar CPU upgrade on a PSU/analog board I think is more reliable. I am still getting some random freezes but Macsbug still works (but does not pop-up automatically) so I am guessing the hardware is at least getting enough juice. I hit the debugger once and got:

NMI

No procedure name
001FF1EC *MOVE.L D0,A0


More recently, I have been getting a "time out" dialog box showing my username and password, and I am unable to find the server.... maybe it is offline? I can connect to the internet otherwise.

Oh, BTW, I cannot read messages using the NNTP server, this has been going on for a while though.
landonf


Posts: 86
Registered: 7/23/12
Re: AppleTalk over IP
Posted: Mar 4, 2013 7:56 PM   in response to: tt in response to: tt
Click to report abuse...   Click to reply to this thread Reply
tt wrote:

Oh, BTW, I cannot read messages using the NNTP server, this has been going on for a while though.

Huh. It's working locally -- what trouble are you seeing?
tt


Posts: 144
Registered: 8/25/12
Re: AppleTalk over IP
Posted: Mar 5, 2013 1:36 AM   in response to: landonf in response to: landonf
Click to report abuse...   Click to reply to this thread Reply
When I open up NewsWatcher, no messages/sub-forums appear like they used to.
bbraun


Posts: 493
Registered: 7/25/12
Re: AppleTalk over IP
Posted: Mar 8, 2013 8:14 PM   in response to: tt in response to: tt
Click to report abuse...   Click to reply to this thread Reply
Do you need to Get Group List From Host again?
tt


Posts: 144
Registered: 8/25/12
Re: AppleTalk over IP
Posted: Mar 8, 2013 8:31 PM   in response to: bbraun in response to: bbraun
Click to report abuse...   Click to reply to this thread Reply
I think I tried it, but I can try again.

Would anyone have a kosher System 7.5.5 folder with networking that would be compatible with the 8MB ROM for an SE/30? If someone could host it in AppleShare, I would appreciate it. I am wondering if my system installes, and the way I set them up is causing these network/stability issues.

Point your RSS reader here for a feed of the latest messages in all forums