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Thread: 128k/512k/Plus Keyboard Interface


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Permlink Replies: 93 - Pages: 7 [ Previous | 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 ] - Last Post: Mar 13, 2018 4:38 PM Last Post By: Popjoel Threads: [ Previous | Next ]
bbraun


Posts: 493
Registered: 7/25/12
Re: 128k/512k/Plus Keyboard Interface
Posted: Feb 19, 2015 7:32 PM   in response to: bigmessowires in response to: bigmessowires
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Yeah, I'm actually the inverse, I prefer the standalone machines, mainly because I dislike CRTs and the compacts are so difficult to work with hardware-wise. The desktops are so much easier to just leave the top case off and mess with. Codewarrior is a good enough development environment for me, although it took a while of messing around to figure out all its glue code and how to make it do some things. But I've been messing with mpw (as opposed to MPW) and doing development on modern systems. Which leads to a need to easily transfer individual files between old and new systems. Usually on a netatalk share.
I actually started doing the Plus ROM stuff simply as an upsell for my wall of Plus' so I could get rid of them. I don't think it's helped me get rid of a single Plus so far. :)

bigmessowires wrote:
I'm not sure a Nubus or PDS reader for SD and thumb drives would offer a practical advantage over using SCSI though, and it would limit the number of machines it could work in.
Yeah, an add-on card is kind of a different beast, particularly because it can't be booted from unless it has already been configured to boot in PRAM, short of other hacks. But it also offers potential to be substantially faster than the 8bit polled SCSI in most of these machines.

To use bluetooth keyboards and mice on your Mac IIci? Couldn't you do this already with your keyboard adapter, by sticking a bluetooth dongle into your ADB-to-USB solution?
It might be possible with a fair bit of modifications to the firmware. It'd need a full bluetooth stack to drive the usb bluetooth dongle. The bluetooth dongles don't present a USB HID device, I think it's more of CDC class, which allows the usb host full access to the bluetooth radio so they can do more than just HID profiles. But there are some prepackaged bluetooth hardware solutions that handle all the bluetooth for you, and allow HID devices to associate, and then output over ttl serial or something. That's more what I was thinking about in an ADB/BT adapter.

That could be nice. How would you enter the WiFi password, if the fact that is was WiFi was hidden from the OS? Or are you thinking of writing some custom driver software for it? I'm thinking there must be some combination of existing wired ethernet and WiFi repeater hardware that could do this already, but maybe not.
I'm currently using a wifi "game adapter" that does wired ethernet to wifi with my powerbook 540c. I've hacked together some software to configure the game adapter, but it's pretty janky. The pb540c has an AAUI port, so you need an AAUI to 10bt adapter, then that feeds into the wifi adapter, all velcroed to the back of the display. This setup is limited to the machines that had ethernet built in, or you're stuck trying to find a SCSI to ethernet adapter, and the HDI SCSI connectors for laptops are huuuge, so you're well into Portable sized luggables by the time you add in all those cables and adapters.
But every laptop had serial, including the duos, which is why I was thinking of something doing this over localtalk. Configuration would need to be out of band, but that doesn't seem impossible. This might be more suited to dougg3's localtalk beaglebone black with a USB wifi dongle.

I looked at the Techstep docs. They were all about how the Techstep is built, and a little bit about how to use it, but they didn't describe how it works at all. There wasn't any mention of the diagnostic protocol or the related ROM functions built into Techstep-compatible Macs. Bummer. But I think some of that info is on the wiki.
Yeah, most of the information on the protocol came from looking at the machine's ROM and just playing with it.
bbraun


Posts: 493
Registered: 7/25/12
Re: 128k/512k/Plus Keyboard Interface
Posted: Mar 4, 2015 8:57 PM   in response to: Arbee in response to: Arbee
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I got an ADB wacom ArtPadII tablet working today (it was missing the stylus, but apparently the Samsung S-Pens work with them, and those are readily available), and was poking at it a bit.
It looks like it presents 2 devices to the system. One is a mouse device (original device ID 3), and one is an absolute positioning device (original device ID 4). It looked like the mouse device was there for compatibility until the driver was loaded, which seems to indicate the absolute positioning devices are defined and there's an interface for them, but no default driver. They define an interface for absolute positioning adb drivers, so that's always a possibility. Just unfortunate that it seems to not be supported by default.
I can now understand why drivers are kind of required by default, but it would have been nice if the protocol was defined for absolute positioning. After playing with the wacom tablet both with and without drivers, it became apparent the drivers were necessary to calibrate how much pressure on the pen indicated a mouse click. Initially, just placing the pen on the pad would register as a mouse click, which made it kind of difficult to use as a general purpose input device. None of that would affect emulators though, which is where it would have been nice if they at least defined the protocol level interface more than just assigning the device ID.

Reading some more in IM: Devices on ADB Manager, not only is there an absolute position device "class", but when the higher dpi adb mice were introduced, they extended the ADB mouse interface, allowing more buttons and greater resolution, as well as extensions for uniquely identifying the mouse device. Among the extensions is a way to specify your "mouse" is really a tablet (with absolute positioning), a mouse, or a trackball. It didn't really differentiate what happens, if anything, between specifying those different device types.
Popjoel

Posts: 3
Registered: 3/13/18
Re: 128k/512k/Plus Keyboard Interface
Posted: Mar 13, 2018 4:35 PM   in response to: bbraun in response to: bbraun
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Hello bbraun:
I am really interested in connecting the keyboard and mouse of a Mac SE (ABD) to a Mac Plus (DB9 and RJ11).
I saw that you know how to do it ....
Could you help me ?
I am also interested in the extension of Rom for Mac Plus.
I live in Spain and I have not found any help in this country.
Thank you.
Popjoel

Posts: 3
Registered: 3/13/18
Re: 128k/512k/Plus Keyboard Interface
Posted: Mar 13, 2018 4:38 PM   in response to: bbraun in response to: bbraun
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Hello bbraun:
I am really interested in connecting the keyboard and mouse of a Mac SE (ABD) to a Mac Plus (DB9 and RJ11).
I saw that you know how to do it ....
Could you help me ?
I am also interested in the extension of Rom for Mac Plus.
I live in Spain and I have not found any help in this country.
Thank you.

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